juan on long term infra

via thomas

Talks like this one from @juanbenet give me hope. https://t.co/XK1itBqKi4

He brings up an approach, similar to encryption, where we make it ridiculously hard and expensive to create doomsday. I.e. sending colonies into deep space without telling anyone where they’re going.

Original Tweet: https://twitter.com/listenaddress/status/1282002566839058432

Long Term Info-structure | Juan Benet @juanbenet – feb 2020 – 90 min video

6 min – think broader than day to day – history of billions of years.. world so similar for so long.. then just from 1 million years ago to 10 yrs ago.. what’s going on right now is really diff than anything that has happened before..

12 min – let’s try to go forward in time.. 10-100 yrs – people in mars.. we hope.. ai.. 1000 yrs – apocalypse.. to million.. lose ability to think about it.. because of the profound diff of now.. we can’t forsee at all what we will do.. hard to understand what’s coming.. even around the corner.. 25 yrs..

13 min – big things have small beginnings.. so hard to predict.. to estimate the value.. things are being played w right now that are presenting radical changes to what it means to be human.. so with that there is danger

mufleh humanity lawwe have seen advances in every aspect of our lives except our humanity– Luma Mufleh

i’m actually more worried about uploads and ai

16 min – doomsday timescale.. graph money vs time.. 1945 – 1960 – unlocked new thing – nuclear program.. billions of dollars..

18 min – i really want to make sure we don’t screw this up.. we’re part of an extraordinary luck thing.. think beyond civilization/galaxy.. but we could screw part of it up.. can’t blow up universe.. but could set ourselves back..

19 min – then on people/countries that could afford the doomsday index.. how many of these people are going to go crazy and try this stuff.. we didn’t have to worry about this 100 yrs ago.. (couldn’t afford it) .. but do have to worry about it now

20 min – we should be working on limiting that (danger).. ie: control tech – but who controls the controllers.. maybe we need larger scale systems that can detect problems as we go along..t

on danger: gershenfeld something else law

on deeper system: cure ios city

22 min – pic of living on mars.. don’t we want this now.. in case something does go bad here

no.. we can do better than that

how is a corp .. actually one of best hopes today for our long term survival.. why is nasa so underfunded.. something really wrong w govt..

deeper than that

24 min – today.. problems people are arguing about.. don’t even fit into these time scales

we need to rethink drastically how we get people to learn things.. t

undo our hierarchical listening .. so we can focus on the itch-in-our-soul hear/see that and we can’t not learn

25 min – can go extinct or not.. so do nothing (or avg) .. or work on solving these problems.. ie: how to move to next realm.. make sure ai goes right.. this is a very important thing to work on ..t

ai humanity needs.. augmenting interconnectedness (not intelligence)

26 min – whatever you’re doing.. make sure it stacks up to this

stuff i’m working on is an attempt to go and fix some of this.. day to day activity can have drastic cosmic impact.. t

revolution of everyday life et al.. in the city.. as the day..

27 min – so 3 problems i’m working on .. t

1\ secure communications for humanity (internet and tor – safe no borders.. perhaps means *fully encrypted communication)

need a means to undo our hierarchical listening ie: 2 convers as infra


2\ secure computation for humanity (web and ipfs – computing systems..integrating w us into whole organism.. how you relate to fellow humans.. think more about us ness)

literacy and numeracy both elements of colonialism/control/enclosure.. we need to calculate differently and stop measuring things

3\ secure flourishing of knowledge (wikipedia, archives et al – construct packages people can install.. like books did – *danger to treat all info equally)

*bigger danger/energy-suck.. is that (i’m guessing) all data is currently non legit.. ie: it’s from whales in sea world

literacy and numeracy as colonialism/control/enclosure.. need to go deeper than pkg deals.. if we want to get to the energy of 8b alive people

listen to 8b daily curiosities and use that data to augment our interconnectedness  ie: cure ios city

all the security ness comes from gershenfeld something else law and that what we need most is the energy of 8b alive people

imagine if we just focused on listening to the itch in 8b souls.. first thing.. everyday.. and used that data to connect/coord us.. we might just get to a more antifragile, healthy, thriving world.. the ecosystem we keep longing (both kinds of longing) for

31 min – there’s a massive crisis of perspective.. most people don’t know how to reason thru something.. we need help people around the planet learn better.. and get to truth.. scientifically verifiable

oi.. intellect ness.. killing us.. we need to let go of thinking that life is all about knowing things.. and realize it’s more about our dance/interconnectedness

‘in undisturbed ecosystems ..the average individual, species, or population, left to its own devices, behaves in ways that serve and stabilize the whole..’ –Dana Meadows

34 min – most of advancements in computing can be boiled down to.. how can we get bits of data to places faster/better/securely.. and how can we functions to apply to that data faster/better/securely.. t

matters first that we have legit data.. (data not from whales in sea world .. and data that matters).. ie: self-talk as data

35 min – all blockchain is is a ledger of data that we all agree is right.. and since programs are just data.. you can think of shoving programs into this ledger of data and then running them.. that’s what bitcoin did from beginning.. just keeping a method of account

36 min – partly why all development (of bc) happened not in sv – because most sv people were all saying.. you’re telling me an accounting system that is worse than my pocket phone will run the econ of the world.. this is insane.. and they were right

should be asking.. why an accounting system.. when what we need is a connecting system.. we need to let go of any form of measuring/accounting

so bc really just a way to reason about the computation.. having a consensus on the outcome of events.. and being able to upload your own little programs.. turns out that is a really powerful primitive

well.. uploading own programs.. (hlb via 2 convers that io dance.. as the day..).. yeah.. but let go of computation/reasoning and consensus.. we can do better than that.. we have to do better than that

that’s where legit trust comes in.. not manufactured trust

37 min – people using this (bc ness) as a new legal structure in computing.. think of smart contracts et al

let go.. thinking we need contracts.. et al.. red flags we’re doing it wrong

vast majority of legal contracts on planet have something to do w moving around ownership.. setting terms.. and now you can do this entirely in a computer and you can trust it.. and you don’t fall into this malicious rational problem.. you can just trust that the computers are doing the right thing

wow.. ownership/setting-terms.. red flags of a deeper cancer.. a cancer called conditional trust (which isn’t trust).. so .. we’re trusting the computer to move around bits of mistrust..

what we need tech to do .. is help us undo our hierarchical listening 

what we need most.. and what we can have.. is tech w/o judgment (ie: contracts/ownership/setting-terms.. all judgements

ie: hlb via 2 convers that io dance.. as the day..

38 min – decentralized web.. taking current computing platform and making secure links.. converging quite quickly to bc..

39 min – these systems present possibility of reliable systems.. even if govt goes against you.. in a way that nobody can interfere with

what we need more.. what would be better.. would be if 8b people were more antifragile.. so that 1\ don’t need to secure us.. we thrive in disorder 2\ if it’s all of us.. we’d all be too busy to be interfering et al (gershenfeld something else law)

40 min – the thing we really care about is offline.. most of people on planet are not plugged into computing system same way you and i are.. we need to change our platforms to address this

ie: 2 convers as infra

42 min – we’re using cryptography to yield a computational platform native to the internet.. not from segregated old world models.. bc and decentralized web.. moving jurisdiction to web.. new way of getting safe/secure computing

? safety/security we need most.. is to let go of judge\ment (which is all about other-ing).. unconditional ness wakes us up.. making most of what you’re talking about (at least the purposes of the techs) a distraction and irrelevant

43 min – lot of people ask me why i am so pro encryption – (para: allows for bad people to take over).. what do we want the rules to be..



gershenfeld something else law

45 min – the crux for me is.. what potential negative future am i trying to avoid.. ie: ways for *few people to control vast amounts of people

already immersed in it.. (ie: supposed to’s.. of school/work) that’s why we can’t see a deep enough solution.. we have no idea what we’re like.. what we’re capable of.. we just keep looking at.. analyzing.. and building things for whales in sea world

that mindset hasn’t worked well for us (ie: safety addiction et al).. let’s try something diff (ie: undisturbed ecosystem)


1\ undisturbed ecosystem (common\ing) can happen

2\ if we create a way to ground the chaos of 8b free people

47 min – there’s a nice interesting window right now.. where we can build really good systems and deploy them everywhere.. what are the rules.. for a really good infra? we don’t know yet.. need to figure this out.. t

ie: 2 convers as infra

rare global pause to reset us.. and we’re missing it

50 min – i’ve been recently obsessed with this problem.. marvin minsky: ‘how can we assign credit for the success among the multitude of decisions’.. i claim that solving this problems for humans is one of the greatest challenges that we have in econ in this century.. if we get this right.. we could rewire our econs to actually do good things

perhaps getting it right means letting go of decision making.. imagining if we focus on curiosity over decision making.. perhaps we’d get to this kind of econ: bachelard oikos law et al

51 min – we don’t have good rep of what we value.. this is because we don’t have good credit assignment at al

go back to your earlier phrases.. who decides what is worthy of credit assignment..

let go man..

we don’t have good rep of what we value.. because legit value can’t be repped/compared.. we need to let go of any form of measuring/accounting

we need to build a much better way to encode our values into our econ.. if we do that.. will see new systems optimizing for right things.. if we solve this problem in next few years.. we could radically change a lot of the world.. t

deeper man.. need to code money (any form of measuring/accounting) as the planned obsolescence

w/ubi as temp placebo.. needs met w/o money..people forget about measuring

54 min – this is the thing i care about the most: our knowledge.. and we have not org’d our species for that yet

i think that’s the thing getting in our way.. reaching for some knowledge rather than being usefully ignorant.. antifragile .. et al

we should give digital info print like qualities.. otherwise have to resort back to books.. his ie: book on philosophy of math

literacy and numeracy as colonialism/control/enclosure

56 min – archiving dimensions.. what should we archive..t

whatever we want.. but archiving isn’t what we need first.. listening to 8b  daily curiosities is what we need.. we need the energy of 8b alive people.. not (the hubris from; assumption of; ..) knowledge

1:02 – starts convo w stewart

stewart brand

1:03 – been working on filecoin – trying to build permanent memory for humanity.. take bitcoin ness and make it do something useful

1:07 – on content address.. ness.. doesn’t rely on going to any particular server

deep address ness

1:12 – actually quite cheap to build things that are on the other side.. really expensive to break

don’t care for the money ref.. but that’s antifragile ness.. if we go deep enough.. to get to the (simple) core (ie: maté basic needs) .. hard to break that

1:19 – i think bc is drastically more concerned w governance than any other.. but need a ton more work

gershenfeld something else law

gershenfeld something else law

gershenfeld something else law

1:24 – by giving everybody a voice.. getting to see all diff perspectives.. all in one go.. we don’t get to pretend they don’t exist any more.. most people disagree about the basic foundations of reality.. this is something we really need to address.. helping people up.. helping people learn

rather.. need to set conditions to undo our hierarchical listening .. so people can hear what’s already in them.. no train et al

1:26 – we for me.. is our tree of life – earth project.. but i think we’re part of something much bigger than that.. how dare we think we have it all figured out.. so much more for us to learn/discover.. if we can do more to help.. yeah.. but let’s just not screw it up

why waste our energy trying to figure it out (in the knowledge sense).. rather than living it out (in the dance sense)