i was finishing Pinker’s the better angels of our nature…  just as the american sniper came out.. so also reading review/opinions on that.. made me wonder much about civilization. my question from Pinker… is violence less.. or just more civilized about violence….. ie: meds we give people, increase in prison population, suicide rate.

i don’t know.


then while swimming a bit in the thought maybe site.. the idea ferments..


too large to comprehend.. too big to change..

people don’t care about fish being left to eat.. because they are in cities… separated.. from the wild. enslaved to a life full of abstract duties made up in an artificial world to keep them addicted to civilization and blindfolded to other ways of lives…

these are no accidents.. just the results of people believing in the domestication of each other and the environment

8 min – idea that machines can organize systems… the world is a system.. and the politicians duty was to maintain that system.. our definition of system is too small – leaves out the immeasurable..

we made it impossible to live in one place without taking resources from somewhere else… starting seeing everyone as resources.. instead of living souls… property/ownership became huge..

so – what can we do now..

12 min – convince me i will change the world by changing the way i shop?

civilization is not sustainable because it’s based on cities.. competition… consumerism..

any way of life based on use of non-renewable resources two things happen: 1)you require the importation of resources 2) depend on violence..

Derrick Jensen

16 min – we have to stop the civilization from killing us

18 min – why are so many passive/oblivious

25 mi – focus on lifestyle changes.. is less effective… focus on decreasing the demand is to start on the wrong end.. what needs to end is the exploitation itself.. ie: the machines destroying/cutting/spraying…

28 min – outsourcing of basic survival skills.. makes us less resilient..

we are addicted to civilization..  we have to realize we are not dependent on civilization.. but on clean air/water/relationships..

30 min – overconsumption leads to numbness

31 min – people need time and awareness

civilized people addicted to the things that are killing them

32 min – Wade Davis – modernity – not failed attempts at being modern.. but wonderful attempts at being alive

38 min – most of the time civilized people are occupied by work.. they don’t have time to stop civilization… can only be working against the system half time.. half to perpetuate half to protest

41 min – fear is what keeps many people from fighting… fear of losing privilege.. fear of


perhaps a better take/flavor of civilization.. has to do with equitable groundhog day ness. instigating utopia everyday.

a nother way.

perhaps seeing ie: play as subversive, is the myth obliging this manner of civilization we now oblige. when perhaps it’s the civilization that is subversive to our nature. [civilization ness does seem to have intent… and so can’t imagine – and is even fearful of – the idea of play w/o intent. you can fight/define intent/subversive ness.. but it’s hard to battle – aka control – whimsy.]

– – –

forests and streets ness.


share via Michel on fb:

… of civilization:
Keith Chandler:
“There are at least eight principal attributes that clearly characterize all civilized societies:
1. A hierarchical social organization dominated by a power elite which is not accountable to the powerless majority and for whose actions there is little or no redress.
2. Concentration of power and wealth in fortified urban centers.
3. Written language, the understanding and use of which are monopolized by the elite and its functionaries.
4. An economic system which vests title to the wealth produced by the society in the elite and controls that wealth by a strictly measured allocation of all industrial, agricultural, forestry, and mining resources within the control of the central power.
5. Skills, training, and labor specialization designed to serve the goals of the power elite.
6. Extensive slavery or serfdom.
7. A grand mythology portraying society as originating from and continuing to be influenced by suprahuman powers with the elite as the conduit of that influence.
8. A military establishment which is utilized not only for external defense and aggression but also for internal control and repression of the dispossessed majority.”
perhaps.. add #9…
9. books cost (so much) money


burke freedom law


from Gabor Maté‘s when the body says no


cancer and the autoimmune disease of various sorts are, by and large, diseases of civilization.


while industrialized society organized along the capitalist model has solved many problems for many of its members – such as housing, food supply and sanitation – it has also created numerous new pressures even for those who do not need to struggle for the basics of existence…

we have come to take these stresses for granted as inevitable consequences of human life.. as if human life existed in an abstract form separable from the human beings who live it..


from David Shenk’s the forgetting:


in the 1980s, as researchers began to contemplate the possibility of trying to defeat alzheimer’s disease.. the search for a fitting animal mode became paramount. no one could develop a successful alz drug w/o first testing it, and refining it on animals.. in order to save human lives, many thousands of nonhuman lives would first be forfeited to science..

perhaps.. better to not create disease in first place.. perhaps today we have means to leap to that.. restart us.. global do-over.. and for that.. we need enough of us humans modeling a way 7bn could leap to today..

ie: hlb via 2 convos that io dance.. as the day..[aka: not part\ial.. for (blank)’s sake…]..  a nother way


the trouble was that, as far as anyone could tell no other creature naturally suffers from alzheimer’s. it is a disease os sophistication..

oy.. like civilization.. which is a great name for dis ease..

how is this not a red flag..?

so looked for best possible sub.. indications of a less elaborate senile dementia in lesser developed mammals. at ten or eleven yrs of age, they noted, some dogs start to have sleeping trouble, pacing around at night and getting lost in familiar surroundings..

schooling the world.. dogs included..