michael and oprah on psychedelic healing
michael pollan and oprah on psychedelics and mental health via tweet [https://x.com/michaelpollan/status/1896980768209199162] via robin carhart-harris quote tweet [https://x.com/RCarhartHarris/status/1897021177274753392]:
This is big. #psychedelics
Can Psychedelics Heal Mental Trauma? Oprah With Harvard Professor Michael Pollan (march 2025) – 53 min video/interview [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9N35WCz_UI]:
In this episode of The Oprah Podcast, Oprah and bestselling author Michael Pollan discuss the potential of psychedelic drugs like psilocybin (also known as magic mushrooms) and LSD as a benefit to help relieve symptoms of PTSD, OCD, anxiety, addiction, or depression. Michael’s 2018 book, “How to Change Your Mind”, was a watershed moment in the rising national conversation about the use of psychedelics in guided therapy.
Michael describes his own psychedelic experiences as well as additional guests, including GoDaddy founder Bob Parsons, who share their stories about how psychedelics helped them improve their mental well-being, cope with trauma and grief and achieve spiritual transcendence. Pollan taught for many years at UC Berkeley and is currently a professor teaching creative writing at Harvard.
notes/quotes:
1 min – o: how to change mind as an opening – 2018
3 min – o: you are the reason for part of this shift.. i think something is happening in the culture
m: since 2018 i never would have imagined how many are doing psychedelic therapy.. i heard esp from scientists .. it’s ok to study psychedelics..
4 min – m: in beginning i wasn’t into them.. afraid of them.. first encounter of roland griffiths (renowned researcher of psychs at johns hopkins) study on people w cancer diagnosis
5 min – m: he really got the psych renaissance started w his research in 2006 – launched whole revival of psych research.. from 50-60’s.. nixon drug war going after lsd to get hippies and cannibas to get blacks.. alcoholism treated.. then shut down and lose 30 yrs of research that is just now resumed
7 min – m: definitely people who should leave it alone.. but people struggling w addiction.. ptsd, trauma.. the term ‘recreational’ is regarded as a negative.. to re create ourselves doesn’ tseem that bad.. but.. the context in which you do it.. ie: greatful dead concert vs in guided room as therapy.. completely diff experience.. the guide is very important
9 min – m: i was scared to take them for myself for a lot of reasons.. would i discover some deep/dark secret about myself.. people do discover traumas they are not looking for
o: yeah.. i would be afraid of losing my mind.. and not getting it back
m: yeah.. i was.. but i also found that doing it w a guide create this safe container in which you can really let go
10 min – m: first experience .. emerged from it w this compassion for people in my life.. most important thing in world is love.. that’s obvious.. but w a conviction i didn’t have before .. it stays w you.. for reasons we don’t understand.. a knowing ness.. it’s revealed knowledge
12 min – m: experience had me talking to trees who were my mother/father..
13 min – m: i think a key word for what psychs do.. is connect you.. because they soften your ego.. your ego is a walled structure.. a defensive.. people feel they are identical to their ego.. but they’re not.. it’s just one voice.. we understand this neuro scientifically.. very similar in meditation.. i became a better meditator.. ego softening.. complete disappearing..
14 min – m: when ego goes down nothing between you and nature .. between you and other people.. you and the universe.. and you feel a sense of one ness
16 min – o: a lot of research on psychs started w treating vets who were suffering from chronic ptsd.. this is where the real break-thrus are.. bob parsons .. founder of godaddy.. diff when came home from vietnam
18 min – b: cost me 2 marriages.. then read michael’s book.. only things that would help if i connected w guys i served with but only lasted a while.. before that i had never taken anything.. reading book was like reading a novel.. reads so quickly.. after 1st experience.. i was a better guy
21 min – (o: what happened) – all that.. iawasca – lot of tears, reliving, .. then psylocibin – flashbacks.. next day played gold.. it was like the trees knew i was there.. the grass.. a kinships.. opened up to knowing how to be loved.. suffering from ptsd don’t feel that way at all.. so that was big
23 min – o: so you and wife now donated millions to psych research.. want it to be treated normal at treatment.. could be a renaissance.. we could have people in jail getting out better than they went it if treated w them because will get at the root causes.. whatever .. all the ugly stuff.. that is causing them to be like they are
24 min – o: do you continue.. or was that 4 days enough for you..
b: i’ve done it again.. totally went home.. i cannot think of a better gift for us and world than to share this stuff.. (why we fund center)
30 min – reagan: michaels netflix doc completely changed my mind.. after episode w mushrooms.. it was the first time in my life my intrusive/invasive thoughts completely went away..first time i was able to be grounded and in the moment and just enjoy my own company and not be scared of what was going to pop into my mind..
31 min – m: i’m very hopeful that change in med is happening.. all treatments we have deal with symptoms.. we have no drugs that deal with causes of mental illness.. and actually provide cures.. and at least in these initial studies.. these trials w couple 100 people.. not huge yet.. we’re seeing positive/lasting results.. some had permanent relief
32 min – m: i was suspicious myself.. this one substance (psylocybin) works on ocd, anxiety, depression, addiction, anorexia, .. this seems a little too good to be true.. i posed this question to a well known psychiatrist.. head of national institute of mental health.. and i said is this a panacea.. is this for real.. and he said.. why do you think all those different things are diff illnesses.. they may be diff manifestations of the same kind of brain.. a brain that is stuck in patterns of behavior and thought that it can’t get out of .. and maybe what psychedelics are doing.. and we are victims of our habits.. they may be diff symptoms rather than diff disorders.. that i understood ..t
to me.. yes.. and so obviously when you see the root of problem
huge
33 min – m: all stemming same thing.. from a rigidity of thought.. and what psychedelics do is make the brain more plastic.. able to learn.. think of sledding down hill.. grooves develop and eventually can’t help to go in groove.. psychedelics are like a fresh snow fall.. you can go down the hill
34 min – dave: how to get them into mainstream
35 min – m: many things we call mental disorders are spiritual diseases.. addiction is a spiritual disease.. i think we need to education med professionals that spiritual approaches have medical value.. t
36 min – o: we use consciousness.. sounds more scientific.. but what is happening is spiritual.. we get hung up on spiritual
m: one other difficulty about incorporating this in our med system.. psychedelic therapy is not just about taking a psychedelic.. should be called .. and often is.. psychedelic assisted psycho therapy because the support of the guide or the therapist is critical to its success. and the fda only regulates drugs not therapy.. so how are they going to deal with this things.. it’s a square peg in a round hole.. that’s going to be a challenge
36 min – o: that’s why i don’t think we’re here yet.. it’s dangerous to have these explorations w/o a guide
38 min – m: guides will say.. if you see a monster don’t run away.. go right up to it and say.. what do you have to teach me.. that attitude of curiosity rather than fear/anxiety changes everything.. in and thru
45 min – m: on being state legal in places.. and fairly safe..
47 min – m: i thought to be spiritual meant to believe in the supernatural.. i realized the essence of spiritual is connection.. deep profound connection w something other than yourself.. opp of spiritual is not material.. it’s egotistic .. ego stand in way of our spiritual development
o: that voice in head constantly judging/measuring.. that part of you that is separate from rest of you
m: gets movies produced.. but also gets in way of connecting w others
48 min – m: i think psychedelics are a short cut (to meditation).. which some people have trouble with.. it breaks people thru so they can meditate successfully.. experiences of nature/art can do it.. lot of diff doors.. psychedelics are just one of them..
50 min – o: w all you now know.. what do you think it means to have a well lived life..
m: i think being present for it.. we spend so much time worrying.. thinking about the future/past.. that we let the present go by.. for me.. psychedelics aren’t a practice.. you’re not going to do it all the time.. but after door is open.. want to keep it alive.. the stories are of you.. you can replay them endlessly.. these are like dreams which are hard to remember.. you remember these..
so great addition to tools for hastening global detox leap
a leap that would finally get at the root of problem
legit freedom will only happen if it’s all of us.. and in order to be all of us.. has to be sans any form of measuring, accounting, people telling other people what to do
how we gather in a space is huge.. need to try spaces of permission where people have nothing to prove to facil curiosity over decision making.. because the finite set of choices of decision making is unmooring us.. keeping us from us..
ie: imagine if we listened to the itch-in-8b-souls 1st thing everyday & used that data to connect us (tech as it could be.. ai as augmenting interconnectedness)
the thing we’ve not yet tried/seen: the unconditional part of left to own devices ness
[‘in an undisturbed ecosystem ..the individual left to its own devices.. serves the whole’ –dana meadows]
there’s a legit use of tech (nonjudgmental exponential labeling) to facil the seeming chaos of a global detox leap/dance.. the unconditional part of left-to-own-devices ness.. for (blank)’s sake.. and we’re missing it
ie: whatever for a year.. a legit sabbatical ish transition
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be you. 