m of care – feb 5
m of care reading conjoined to lse’s reading group – on the democracy project
notes\quotes from meeting (73 present):
questions:
how to do it at scale
ie: as infra
what material support needed for something like occupy to happen
ie: short bp
how does the contagion happen
org’d around something 8b souls already crave
matthieu: quick movements because people already trained in it
yeah.. we can go deeper .. i see thinking that we need training as a red flag
lisa: on not coercing anyone.. just no other way .. than consensus to move a group
ayca: once you see it you cannot unsee it
yeah that.. ie: short findings restate
saybie: ch 5 – once you experience freedom one time.. that thought does not go from your mind.. that is a part of the success of occupy.. ch3 – a lot of democracies we have today are not true democracies.. ie: constitution designed to prevent populist rule.. rulers were afraid of people having rule.. it was embedded in constitution that it would not be a democracy
angela: on fear of contamination.. ie: requirements of having to teach those documents in uni.. very explicit/aggressive.. legislatures speak to provosts to talk to us to capitulate to what the legislature might want.. always meant w so much force.. that kind of imagination
mark fuller: david himself marveled/surprised that liberation could occur at that level/size
brian: on the surprise.. same to 30 yrs ago.. battle in seattle..
lisa: as a teacher.. feels a very shifting moment.. fantasy that good ed is going to lead to something.. any work that works to build across those generations.. any tools.. ie: one of my favs is the people’s mics.. open up spaces for my students.. on how does one address carrying practices across generations
michael sinclair(part of diem): on zinn’s history – political institution of design that has led to (all this).. we’re not going to change this system.. but can start talking about is a way of putting a governor on politics during term of office.. so decisions aren’t purely based on a party.. but on citizen assemblies et al
? – wow.. we have to change the system
david (video guy): i think most of us have this question.. why would we lead (leave) if we don’t believe we can change the political system..
simona: david ‘never give up things voluntarily’.. my experience in italy .. the contamination from occupy arrived here in 2 ways..
ayca: is that true in other’s experiences.. does consensus dm always lead to hierarchy .. is it always temporary?.. t
decision making is unmooring us law
public consensus always oppresses someone(s)
today we have the means to go way deeper.. to undo our hierarchical listening
sidney: on this generational issue.. i don’t think we can just pass on a model..
ayca: i think there’s diff processes in extraordinary moments.. the impossible becomes possible..
angela: just as the youth can bring that moment.. but also it’s the capacity to withstand the oppression that helps that pressure explode.. on situated temporality includes space of practices.. anal of extraction that inform that moment.. there are dangers in continuity.. and in use of the memory.. also in imagining that everything is a blank slate
marisa: on ows documentary – all day all week – free
ayca: maybe we can screen it together
ayca: what about issues of representation.. everything david is doing is a rep of movement. . the world is on fire
ayca: it’s tempting to read the book as a template for repetition.. i don’t want us to do that.. but i don’t want us to be afraid to take certain conclusions
david van duzer- video guy: i have a question about all of us white guys speaking for the common people.. on roberts rules working diff for people who are not white.. consensus taken for granted of a thing we do.. some of this is understanding how we can undo the past
begs we undo our hierarchical listening
nika: on defn’s of democracy and communism.. but how we deal w each other is very complex.. ie: in the book how consensus was working in one situation and really bad in another.. i think we now should try to recover ‘democracy’ and ‘communism’.. i think david was genius w ‘everyday communism’
yes.. and with his revolution of everyday life.. that complex
elena: on people realizing they are the 99%
have to go deeper.. has to be all of us .. or it won’t work
michael (diem guy): aren’t we all dealing w money.. in these debates we have to keep in mind.. what is effective..
lorenzo velotti: i was thinking about the 99% and another of david’s phrases the caring classes.. and seeing occupy as the revolt of the caring classes.. so i was wondering are they the same or diff? .. if diff.. that would bring back class..
even leaving 1% brings back class
steve rushton: back in london’s occupy .. it was against the city as a whole.. 99% seemed more relevant there.. and caring class seems more relevant as we go forward..
juanito: 1% are those who have leverage/power of fin system.. then on.. people can talk a lot . . but who is actually doing the homework.. do we actually know what we want to do.. what are real issues.. still elected powers are part of that.. i think proposal david was interested in was ubi.. still needs coord with those in power.. seems to be starting to work out.. but i don’t think anybody is studying it enough to have a proper convo about it in my opinion
again.. don’t think it will work if it’s not all of us.. need to every/legit.. voice
and.. we need let go of any form of m\a\p – which ubi doesn’t do.. so it needs to be as temp placebo
amy heller: harder for us to talk to one another.. and i think that has to do w sm.. being full of trolls/agitators..
what we need is a mech that is for 100% of us.. that listens to 100% of our legit voices
nika: david was trying to replace this marxist structure w his caring class notion.. i hope somebody will keep developing that.. because i think that’s huge.. there’s a possibility to redefine everything in our society..t
yeah.. perhaps time to go with 100%.. (i don’t think it will work unless it’s all of us) .. and.. today we have the means to undo our hierarchical listening
marisa: on 99% ness.. now very divided.. we started to believe the state’s narratives about ourselves.. ie: spokes council.. interrupted.. difficult to have convos about race that are healing in any way.. and probably the greatest challenge we are facing today.. tensions are very high and everyone is dealing w pain/frustration/fear/oppression.. that’s not adequately dealt with..t
yes.. must go deeper.. let’s try: 2 conversations as infra
imagine if we just focused on listening to the itch-in-8b-souls.. first thing.. everyday.. and used that data to augment our interconnectedness.. we might just get to a more antifragile, healthy, thriving world.. the ecosystem we keep longing for.. what the world needs most is the energy of 8b alive people
lorenzo shared david on caring class: https://www.college-de-france.fr/site/grandes-conferences/David-Graeber.htm
ozgun aksakal: not focus on 99%.. but why the 99%.. overlooking potential for change.. why does any movement starting wanting to claim a democracy also 99%
gabi: next friday is david’s bday.. so inviting you to bday party.. 8pm london time.. on nika’s zoon.. just talking and having fun to commemorate his 60 yrs
at Nika Dubrovsky’s zoom https://bit.ly/3kifxZYID : 604 596 7588 Password: CITY Agenda: around the campfire, we’ll talk about magic, David, and memories! There might be some dancing too. If you’d like a fancy image to print & hand out ☟https://bit.ly/39Q9ity
ayca: i’ll suggest bs jobs for next time..
____________
____________
_____________
_____________
____________
be you. 